47 – Start At The End

Today on the Book Launch Show we talk more about finding and connecting with your tribe, those true fans who love your work and who will continue to tell others about it. First off you want to grab the attention of those people who read a lot, not the folks who get halfway through a book on vacation once a year. We discuss the importance of practicing a number of one-liners that tell your audience exactly what your books are about and the market you serve, and then memorizing the one that translates best to advertising copy and all other communications. Knowing where you ideal readers hang out and who they typically follow on social media is another great way to identify and make contact with tribe leaders who are going to help you get the word out. Join us for this episode to find out more!

Key Points From This Episode:

  • More about Seth Godin’s Akimbo podcast and his ideas around true fans.
  • Focusing on attracting a solid number of committed fans rather than trying to be famous.
  • First reaching out to and targeting people who are avid readers.
  • Continuing to pitch your book in different ways to people on your email list.
  • Establishing and communicating the benefits for someone to read your book.
  • Memorizing that concise sentence that tells your audience exactly who your books are for.
  • Taking every opportunity to reach out to your audience and promote your product.
  • Paying careful attention to where your personas hang out and who they follow.
  • Using social media to connect with influential tribe leaders and getting them on board.
  • And much more!

Links Mentioned in Today’s Episode:

Tim Grahl — https://booklaunch.com/

Tim on Twitter — https://twitter.com/timgrahl

Valerie Francis — https://valeriefrancis.ca/

Valerie on Twitter — https://twitter.com/valerie_francis

The Story Grid Editor Roundtable Podcast — https://valeriefrancis.ca/podcast/

Running Down a Dream — https://www.amazon.com/Running-Down-Dream-Winning-Creative/dp/1936891557

Seth Godin — https://www.sethgodin.com/

Tribes on Amazon — https://www.amazon.com/Tribes-We-Need-You-Lead/dp/1491514736

Purple Cow on Amazon — https://www.amazon.com/Purple-Cow-Transform-Business-Remarkable/dp/014101640X

The Dip on Amazon — https://www.amazon.com/Dip-Little-Book-Teaches-Stick/dp/1591841666

Free Prize Inside on Amazon — https://www.amazon.com/Free-Prize-Inside-Make-Purple/dp/1591841674/ref=sr

All Marketers Tell Stories on Amazon —https://www.amazon.com/All-Marketers-are-Liars-Works/dp/1591845335 

Akimbo — https://www.akimbo.me/

Kevin Kelly — https://kk.org/

Game of Thrones https://www.hbo.com/game-of-thrones

Avengers Endgamehttps://www.marvel.com/movies/avengers-endgame

[0:00:00.3] TG: Hello and welcome to the Book Launch Show. My name is Tim Grahl and this is the podcast where we help you figure out, building author platforms, launching books and book marketing. In this episode, Valerie and I, we start off talking about Seth Godin and a recent couple of episodes of his podcast. I’m going to come back to Seth Godin in a minute.

Then we get into talking about tribes, where to locate them and then really how all of this stuff works together that we’ve been talking about a websites and email lists and all of that. Then we land in what I think is a really important place where we talk about different ways to look at finding your audience.

This can be a really hard – I mean, it’s hard for me as well especially with my own books but even when I’m working with clients, to continue to look at this from a new perspective. I think this is a really helpful episode, hopefully it will give you some new ideas about where you can find your audience and how to find your audience.

Also, coming back to Seth Godin, this is normally the part of the podcast where I tell you about something, right? You should hire one of our coaches, you should by one of my books, that kind of thing. And, I want to just mention here Seth Godin. I’m sure most of you are familiar with him and his work. Way back when I had my – I had graduated college and I got my first job and I hated that job.

You have to understand, when I was going through college, I remember talking to people when they would ask me what I wanted to do and I was like, I just want to get a good job where I can work hard, get a good salary and take care of my family.

The idea of being an entrepreneur and starting my own thing was never really something I thought I wanted. I graduated college, I got my first job and I just hated that job and I was convinced it was this place sucks, I need to just find a better place to work. I was there for a while and I found another job and I went there and it was literally within a couple of weeks I realized like my gosh, this place is worse than the place I left.

I really started getting scared thinking like, is this what I’m stuck doing, are there other options? I came across, when I was looking online for just – I don’t really know, inspiration or options or something and I came across Seth’s blog and it just really spoke to me and was my first glimpse in looking at the world in a completely new and interesting way.

I mean, that was probably 15, 16 years ago and so for that long, Seth’s work has been inspiring me and I think about his books, Tribes, which is probably the basis, the most foundational thing of all the work I do but his other ones like Purple Cow, The Dip, Free Prize Inside, All Marketers Are Liars which he renamed, I forget what he renamed it. All marketers are storytellers or something.

All of these books I’ve read, I don’t think I’ve read every single one of his books because he has a lot of books but I’ve read most of them and they all force you to look at the world in a new way and every time I’ve seen him speak or interacted with him, he just completely blows my mind.

I would recommend if you haven’t picked up a book from Seth Godin, if you’ve never read one, definitely pick up a copy of Tribes and give that a read but otherwise, if you know, if you just haven’t read something by Seth in a while, pickup copy of a book that you maybe have, buy a new one, it’s really good stuff, really inspiring and what I like about his work is that he’s consistent and he lives by his values.

I’ve worked with a lot of really well-known thought leaders or gurus or whoever and a lot of times, way more than any of us would like to know about, who they really are does not match their public persona and when push comes to shove, they kind of – they don’t really live the stuff that they write about and every time I’ve interacted with Seth. I know lots of people that interact with him as well, he’s always extremely consistent about holding to his values.

When he writes about something, I really trust it because I think he really believes it. Anyway, that’s my long commercial for Seth Godin, I’m a big fan of his, he’s changed my life from afar in many ways and many times. Go pick up a copy of any of Seth’s books, you won’t be disappointed.

Okay, from there, let’s go ahead and jump into this episode and get started.


[0:04:45.0] ANNOUNCER: Welcome to the Book Launch Podcast, helping authors launch and market their books.


[0:05:02.6] VF: Hello Tim, how are you this week?

[0:05:05.7] TG: I’m doing fine.

[0:05:06.8] VF: Good. Okay, this week, I wanted to continue our discussion on sales but before we begin that, I just wanted to mention a couple of things. I listen to Seth Godin’s podcast at Akimbo and the last two episodes have been about things that we’ve been talking about here on our show.

If anyone listening, also subscribes to Akimbo, check out the Fooled by Spectrum podcast because he talks about the 1,000 true fans and it’s exactly the thing that we were talking about when we talked about that and he said, if you have a 1,000 true fans then that’s your base and if you can hit 10,000 true fans, it’s a home run. I thought that was really interesting.

[0:05:49.3] TG: Yeah, I mean, that comes from, the original guy to talk about that was Kevin Kelly and the idea was, if you had a thousand fans that paid you a thousand dollars each for whatever you’re creating, no, hundred dollars each for whatever you’re creating, that’s $100,000. That’s a pretty good living for a creative.

It was kind of this base, it’s been a long time since I’ve read it, but the way I remember it is it was kind of this reaction to, you don’t have to be this like famous person to make a living as a creative. If you can just find a thousand people that like your work and are willing to pay $100 a year for whatever you’re creating, you can make $100,000 a year.

I’ve seen people that do all these stuff to refute it or argue or whatever and I don’t think he meant it as like this gold standard. I think it was just more of like hey, think this way instead of feeling like you have to be famous.

[0:06:50.7] VF: That makes sense.

[0:06:52.3] TG: With authors, it’s going to be a little different unless you’re churning out 10 books a year, you’re going to have to have a larger, if you’re coming out with one book a year, you know, you need to have 10,000 people giving you $10 a year, something like that. But it’s still just this kind of nice round number of like okay, well what do I really have to do to make $100,000 a year as a creative.

Then I also think, well, I don’t know where you’re going with this because I could keep going because then you can talk about, well you could have like different types of things, you’re making money on so that you’re not putting so much pressure on just your writing to make all the money or whatever.

I’m going to let you actually ask your question.

[0:07:36.4] VF: It was just more of a comment than anything because I remember when Seth came to talk to us at this Story Grid love story workshop. He mentioned something that I’d heard other people say before but for some reason, when he was explaining it, it clicked to me.

That most people only read one book a year. Yes, it’s entirely possible to become a billionaire author, we know it’s possible because JK Rowling has done it. Yes, it’s possible. But the ratchet that needs to happen to go from where someone like me where I am now in my career to there, it starts with finding that first 1,000 true fans. Well it starts really with writing a really great book.

I’m assuming that to me, that’s understood. Then, finding a thousand true fans for that and those thousand true fans, they start to tell their friends because they want to have someone to talk to about the book. Because the book is well written, you know, the second layer of fans say, for a lack of a better description, they start to tell another group of friends.

Remember that shampoo commercial or maybe you’re too young and I’m just too old. I can’t remember the shampoo commercial but it was, “I tell two friends and you tell two friends” and so on. Someone out there will remember what that shampoo commercial was for.

[0:09:01.7] TG: I have no idea what you’re talking about.

[0:09:05.8] VF: Damn, I just feel old when this happens, it was probably in the 70s and you weren’t born yet, oh my god. Was it Pert? Plus maybe? I can’t remember. Anyway, it was a great shampoo commercial and they would divide up the screen and every time someone talks about an idea virus or something going viral or things spreading by word of mouth, this commercial from 40 years ago, 45 years ago, flashes through my mind because I can see the screen dividing.

It’s a great visual representation of how it works, it starts with one person who really loves the product and in this case, the product is a novel and wanting to share it with a friend because they want to be able to talk to someone about it.

You got to read this great book and well, we just had the same thing with Game of Thrones, where the last season has come out and it’s like okay, no spoilers, same with the Avengers Endgame. It’s the same type of ratchet effect and it’s entirely possible for it to happen in fiction but it really relies on you being the best writer that you can be and creating a story that people want to tell other people about.

I thought that was really interesting. Just reinforces the types of things that we kind of have already spoken about. The other episode is, I think it’s called Car Dealers and Your Future, what does that have to do with books, right? It sounds like nothing. But if you listen to his argument in it, he gets down to the point of permission marketing and having a mailing list.

People don’t want email anymore; they want me mail. You and I talked about this as well when we were talking about my book club and then my author updates and how the emails that I could send out were relevant to the subscribers. They were meeting what the subscribers wanted and what I needed.

I thought that was really interesting because he’s talking about it from in a totally different industry but it’s the same principle.

[0:11:11.4] TG: Yeah, I want to go back to the thing you mentioned about most people read one book a year. Because that’s true. I think the thing to remember as writers, it really is any marketing issue, you always want to go after the nerds first.

[0:11:29.1] VF: Absolutely.

[0:11:31.3] TG: You want to get people that read more than one book a year to read your book first. Because it’s an easier sell. If it’s somebody like me who is always reading the next book, getting me to give your book a try is going to be much easier than if it’s my one book that I’m taking on vacation this year.

I just wanted to mention that because sometimes, these stats are helpful and sometimes they’re not and I think sometimes it can be a little demoralizing to think, okay, well, most people read one book a year and I think what you’ve got to do is like find the person that’s reading a dozen or two dozen or three dozen books a year and get your slot into one of those.

It’s much easier to convert a nerd reader to give your book a try than it is somebody who reads very passively or once a year.

[0:12:30.9] VF: Well, this is why Kindle unlimited is so attractive for so many authors. Because it’s people who read so much that having a subscription is cheaper, right?

[0:12:40.1] TG: Yeah, I have that. Well, it was cool, because like, a friend of mine wrote this book series that I’m on the second book of and she was like, well I’ll just give you the book, I’m like no, I’ll get them on Kindle unlimited because then, I don’t pay for them but you do. You get paid for them.

[0:12:55.4] VF: That’s right.

[0:12:58.1] TG: I think it’s a cool system.

[0:12:59.4] VF: And book clubs and this goes back to other conversations that we’ve had where you’ve been asking me and I’m still searching for answers, where do these people hang out online or in groups or how do you target them? Because you’re right. These are the people that you want to go after, the people who are reading, who are committed to a book club and reading a book a month is not a big deal to them, right? They’re looking for authors that no one else has heard before.  A new story, a new voice. They’re interested in that.

[0:13:36.2] TG: Yeah.

[0:13:36.8] VF: I thought, that was all – I mean, this is not new information but it was sort of reaffirming what I’ve been learning and it came from a totally different source. Sometimes you need to –

[0:13:48.6] TG: Yeah, that’s helpful.

[0:13:48.9] VF: Yeah. Okay, all right, I’m on the right track, this is – not that I doubted that you are putting me on the wrong track now, mind you?

[0:13:59.6] TG: Sometimes you have to hear it, well, you experienced this with your children where they come home and they’re like, I learned this thing and I’m like, I’ve been trying to teach you that for like years. Totally understand.

[0:14:13.3] VF: Yes, my son is living in Montreal for the summer and he’s working at a restaurant and he texted me yesterday to say that Gwyneth Paltrow had come into the restaurant and then he proceeded to tell me who Gwyneth Paltrow was and I’m like, oh my. “That’s iron man, you remember Iron Man, mom? She plays Iron Man’s wife.” I’m like, “Yeah. Okay. Thanks honey.”

I remember her before she was anybody. Okay, back to selling, all right, here’s what I know about selling, it’s going to take all of three seconds for me to tell you. One, I know that selling is doing something for someone, not to someone. You’re not trying to push things at people that they don’t want. What you’re trying to do is match the product or service you have with the need that the customer has, okay?

That means that I’m not trying to sell my books to people who one, aren’t interested in reading very much or two, aren’t interested in reading the type of books that I write. Okay, very high level concept but that much I got. The other thing I know about it is that you’ve got to make them want the thing you have and you don’t sell the thing, you sell the benefit of the thing.

Now I’m stuck. That’s as far as I can go. These are all high level concepts which took me a long time to sort of wrap my head around and observe as I do case studies and stuff like that. My question is, how do I get from there to where I want to go.

What are the practical steps, even the next steps, I don’t even know what the next steps are, practical or not.

[0:15:53.9] TG: You lost me a little bit. What do you mean?

[0:15:56.5] VF: Okay, there’s – if I picture my personas, my ideal readers out there, they’re looking for books like mine and I have to sort of let them somehow let them know that my books exist and to convince them to give my books a try. How do I do that?

[0:16:17.2] TG: Okay. I like to start with the end and then kind of work backwards. A very simple way to do this is with the three emails that people get when they sign up, we went through that, right? That’s one some simple way is knowing that within a week of somebody subscribing to your email list, you’re asking them to buy a copy of your book.

Because those emails, upsell your book. Then you know that everybody that gets on your email list is going to get a pitch to buy your book within the first week. Then you know that when you go on a podcast or speak at a conference or whatever and you invite people to join your email list, you know that they’re going to get pitched the book within a week of signing up for the email list.

A lot of it is creating that kind of system where people are automatically getting sold your book when they sign up for the email list. Am I answering the question you’re asking?

[0:17:22.1] VF: Yes, so far, those things I have in place.

[0:17:26.0] TG: Then it kind of becomes two things. One is, you have to keep doing outreach to keep getting more people on your email list. So we have talked a lot about outreach but you’ve got to keep growing your email list and then you’ve got to keep basically pitching your book to your audience in different ways and so have you thought through, what are the benefits, if I was to say what are the benefits of somebody buying or reading your book, what would you say?

[0:17:57.6] VF: Well the way I am pitching it is that each part is the length of a glass of wine or a soak in the tub or commute home. So it is a short read. It is not a huge commitment and it is a chance to escape and relax.

[0:18:12.3] TG: So I like the end of that the best, right? So it is a way to escape and relax and the other thing that I think you can do that would be helpful that we have talked a lot about here is say things like, “If you love this author you’d love this book” or “If you love this book, you will love this book.” Give people some context around that because it shows them that if they really enjoyed reading these types of books they are really going to enjoy your book as well because that implies the benefits, right?

“If you enjoy this then you will enjoy this” because the whole thing with fiction in particular is enjoyment and relaxation, escape, all of those things you just said but we are basically doing it for entertainment and enjoyment and so I think leaning into that is important and this is where I think that a lot of times, fiction authors really struggled because they think I don’t know what the benefit of reading my book is and I am always like, “Well have you read a fiction book? Why do you like reading fiction?”

Whatever it is that makes you like fiction is why other people will like your fiction and so use that as well and so I think in most cases for you, if you are speaking to the right audience, it is a pretty simple pitch of just like, “I write fiction for women that are in a hurry. If you like book X, Y or Z or authors X, Y and Z then you’re going to love a copy of my book. I think you’ll really enjoy it. You should go download the first part here.” I don’t think it is much more complicated than that.

Because once you have your pitch down it becomes just getting in front of more people so that you can give your pitch to people that it begins to have an impact. Does that make sense?

[0:20:07.4] VF: Okay, so the pitch then you’d need to have a couple of variations of it depending on the type of outreach you are doing, right? Like you need to have sort of shorter versions, say if you are doing a podcast interview then you have time to talk and you have time to explain what the story is about and that would be the longest form but then if you are doing something like an add or even a social media post, it is really short. So you would need to have something really – Some really short punchy version of that pitch, right?

[0:20:46.3] TG: Sure, so one thing is, you need to have your one sentence down, right? So mine is always, ‘I help authors build their platform, connect with readers and sell more books.’ I have said that thousands of times and so having your one sentence about, ‘I write fiction for women in a hurry that loved authors, whatever’ like maybe that is one, and this is one of those things where you should probably write out 20 or 30 different ones to find one that you really like.

And then you just memorize it and just say it every chance that you get. So on a podcast yeah, you will have a longer form to talk about stuff but at the end of the podcast, the podcaster is going to say, “Well how can people find out more about you?” and you say, “Well I write fiction for women in a hurry that like authors X, Y and Z. If you’d like to download the first part of my book, you can get it valeriefrancis.com/part1” or whatever you come up with.

So you need to have something really tight then you just use that over and over. So that can go in an ad that can go in. Actually if you are running ads, you could test five or six different one of these to see which one converts better and then make that your tagline. That would be an interesting experiment but whatever it is you need to have a very short, “This is what I do and here is how you can get it” and you need to be able to say it in a way where like if I woke you up at a dead sleep and said tell me what you do, you’d be able to say it. You know what I mean?

So that is the biggest thing because it just continually brings people in and then you just need new and interesting ways and not even interesting, you just need constantly new ways to get in front of it. You know I mean sometimes I think when I say “new and interesting” like again, we talked about this but it is hard to over say how much of a boring grind it is. So I don’t think you need to come up with new and interesting ways to get in front of people, you just need to get on another 20 podcasts.

[0:23:12.3] VF: Right and that is something that I am noticing. You know I don’t bring it up every single week because we would just be saying the same thing every single week but I am still doing all of those research in the background of looking for podcast, looking for book clubs, all that kind of stuff. It is a slow steady process and it is not sexy but there it is. It is effective.

[0:23:36.3] TG: Yeah and so that is like most of the work is that first getting all of that set up, right? So making all of the decisions about what you are promoting and how you are presenting yourself to the world then translating that into your website and your email list and all of that and then figuring out how you are going to talk about that and invite people in but then you just have to keep going out and getting a chance to say that to more people.

And again, it is lots of different ways like, if you do meet an author that writes woman’s fiction and she is up to sending a link out to where people can download the first part of your book, you know, it is like there you go. That is a really great intro but all you are going to do is you are going to set up maybe a special page for that partnership but it is going to put them into the same system you have already built.

[0:24:35.8] VF: Right.

[0:24:38.5] TG: So right now, I am going back and forth with a software they do. They had a software that helps authors with their marketing and I am trying to get them to let me do a three-part video series that they promote to all of their users and their audience and email list as a way to provide value to them but they sign up – they have to give me their email address to get it. So I am just looking for any ways that I could partner with other people that I think have an audience that would be interested in what I am doing.

[0:25:17.0] VF: And the pitch then just to come back to what we were talking about a minute ago, the pitch that I come up with when I am crafting my 20 different examples has to pitch my book in a way that meets the needs of the reader, right? If what my reader really wants is to escape for 20 minutes and not have any children touching her for a few minutes just to be left alone and have peace and quiet for 20 minutes, if that’s what she wants then I have to describe my book in a way that enables her to connect with that and to relate with it and to say, “Ah this is what I need.”

[0:25:55.6] TG: Yeah and I think it might take some trial and error in trying out a few different ones to see which ones seems to get the best reaction but then once you find one that works that just becomes your kind of go-to thing, does that make sense?

[0:26:09.9] VF: It does.

[0:26:10.8] TG: I could you see you, so I have a friend who has a middle grade series and his entire probably 90% of his marketing has been finding stay at home and home school moms, reaching out to them on Instagram, sending them a free copy of his book, the first book in the series and then following up then offering to do a giveaway to their audience of all of the books in the series and then that person posts on their Instagram feed, “Hey follow us and leave a comment” or leave a comment and tag a friend or something like that to enter this promotion.

And then his book gets exposed to the three thousand, 10,000, 50,000 Instagram followers of that person. I think that doing stuff like that would be good for you because it is women – because the more that you talk about it the more you are saying you know it is women with children, write that, just have 5 minutes or 20 minutes to read here and there is your audience. So where can you find pockets of those women and get them to give your book a try?

So that could be something that you could be doing to get your book out into the world. Again, it is always where are people congregating that fit your personas, who is the tribe leader of whatever that congregation is happening and how can I get my book in the hands of that person and get them to introduce me to their tribe?

[0:27:56.4] VF: Oh no, I never thought about thinking about mom groups. I did think about them when I was – because I started with the middle grade fantasy, right? That is my first book, it is a middle grade fantasy, and I was thinking about mom bloggers and that kind of stuff then but I hadn’t been – for some reason I never thought about them for this. Okay, I have to put my thinking cap on and have a look and see what is around for that because I bet you there is a lot more in a way of podcasts. I don’t know, maybe. Yeah, I have to think about it and see what is out there to broaden the search.

[0:28:27.7] TG: I mean, I am looking at your personas right now and your persona number one is Jennifer and her profession is stay at home mom. So where are stay at home moms congregating on the Internet and who are they following? I mean if you start scratching the surface, there are hundreds of these mom Instagram feeds that have 5,000, 10,000, 20,000, 50,000 followers.

[0:29:04.6] VF: There is bazillion book reviewers on Instagram that is what I have discovered, holy Hannah.

[0:29:10.3] TG: Yeah, I mean so I like talking high level about things but this is really deep too of like or very tactical of right now Instagram is probably the biggest social media platform as far as engagement and growth. Actually engagement for sure I have looked at the numbers and so I look at Instagram or I look at social media two ways that are useful. One is it is a one-on-one connection. It is really good for connecting with people one on one not one to many.

And it is much easier to leverage other people’s followings and build your own, right? If you can get 10 people with 10,000 followers each to put their book in their feed that is a 100,000 people you have reached without having to build your own following of a 100,000 people and the biggest thing again is it’s so funny when I talked to my buddy about this because it is like, he sits – like when he is watching TV at night, he gets on Instagram and he goes through and sends, messages people.

That stay at home moms, mom Instagramers and says, “Hey” copy and paste, “I’ve got this book, I’d love to send you a copy” and anybody that responds the next day he just sits at his kitchen table and packs books in envelopes and then ships them out and then two weeks after he ships them out he follows up, “How did you like the book?” if they say they like it he offers to do a giveaway to their audience and most of them take them up on it.

So it is this like four to six-week process per person that is just a daily 15 to 30-minute thing. You know when he got his book deal they only agreed to publish the first two in the series and now they are publishing the entire series of nine because they have been selling so well and this is 90% of what he is done for marketing.

[0:31:07.1] VF: Okay.

[0:31:08.6] TG: But if you look at it, it is doing exactly what we are talking about, which is who are my personas, who are the tribe leaders that have followings, where are those people showing up, what would be a win-win that I could reach out and offer, right? So the first is a free book. The second is doing a giveaway to their audience.

[0:31:29.4] VF: Okay. All right, I have to put on my thinking cap on and see. Isn’t that funny? I am the one who created those personas and it never occurred to me to look at it like this. I guess that is why they pay you the big bucks.

[0:31:43.1] TG: That’s right.

[0:31:44.8] VF: All right.

[0:31:45.3] TG: So I mean looking at your other ones, it’s like okay, so I am looking at persona number three, Elizabeth. Her profession is in male-dominated professions, sciences and engineering. I guarantee you there are monthly groups in major cities of women that get together that are in the sciences and engineering. I guarantee you there are forums. I guarantee you there are email lists. I guarantee you there’s probably official organizations, you know what I mean?

That speak directly to women in the sciences and then it becomes the same kind of thought experiment, which is, okay, where are these women congregating? We talked about a few probably, who is in charge of those groups, how can I create a win-win that would allow me to introduce myself to those groups?

[0:32:35.7] VF: This is more homework.

[0:32:38.1] TG: More, that is my favorite part of these calls is like I give you stuff to do and then I am done until next week.

[0:32:44.2] VF: That’s right. Just because I don’t come back every week and say, “Here is all the wonderful things I found” doesn’t mean I am not doing them, but this is something that I think is a stumbling block for a lot of authors is that it takes time to do this research and it takes consistent effort overtime to do the research, because you can’t stop writing in the meantime just to stop and market. You got to keep everything moving.

[0:33:08.4] TG: And two things, one is I think this is really good because by default you should be getting on podcasts, right? That is the one I use all the time, but there are a 100 different ways to do this and it is very particular to the type that your personas, your book, where you should be reaching out and so that is one thing and the other is it does become easier overtime, right? So once you start working with one group, it is easier to get in with other groups. So it has a flywheel effect where then it just becomes – I mean it still takes work but it doesn’t seem so overwhelming.

[0:33:54.1] VF: All right I am holding you to that.

[0:33:56.9] TG: That’s right.

[0:33:58.8] VF: Okay, well I’d better go and start doing some more research.

[0:34:02.3] TG: All right, until next week.

[0:34:03.9] VF: Thank you, Tim.


[0:34:04.7] TG: Thanks for listening to this episode of the Book Launch Show. For all the past episodes, the show notes, or to connect with me, you can go to booklaunchshow.com. I have dozens of free book marketing resources and articles that you can access at my website booklaunch.com. Lastly, if you like to support the show, you can do that by telling another author about the show and by visiting us on Apple Podcast and leaving a rating and review.

Thanks for subscribing and being a part of our work here at booklaunch.com. We will see you next week.


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